Maddow: Vanishing Afghan Army Disproves Premise Of U.S. Presence In Afghanistan 1

Maddow: Vanishing Afghan Army Disproves Premise Of U.S. Presence In Afghanistan

 

Rachel Maddow looks at how Trump administration negotiations with the Taliban for U.S. departure from Afghanistan began the process of the U.S.-trained Afghan army mostly just stepping aside for the Taliban takeover, settling the question of whether the U.S. mission to stand up an Afghan defense force to secure the country was achievable. 
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99 comments

    1. @Alfred Basurto Coinkydinkly enough, in 2019 the U.S. and Vietnam trade was a little over $81B. According to estimates, Afghanistan has around $3T in untapped oil and mineral resources. The world’s 2nd largest economy shares a border just to the south of Afghanistan. I wouldn’t be surprised if China has a trade delegation ready to go. Imho

    2. @أمة واحدة One nation
      Taliban should start with:

      There is no compulsion in religion (quran 2:256)

  1. This is a non-partisan issue, Republicans and Democrats over the last 20 years failed to define a mission and fostered corruption.

    1. Except for Rep. Barbara Lee. She voted against this stupid 20-yr. war right from the start. Everybody should have listened to her.

    2. americans and their craven military, as usual, abandoning their sycophants after causing lots of deaths and destruction.
      oligarchic usa regime and its citizens living off looted resources of others, must be made to pay for their crimes.

    3. @Alyson onOahu I doubt the billions sent there EVERY month to corrupt Afghan officials for 20 years HELPED the situation.

      General Dynamics, Lockheed-Martin, Raytheon, Blackwater/Xe no-bid contracts…..The US was giving the Afghans a “Master Class” in corruption, for decades.

      Don’t kid yourself…the US is NOT exactly the best example to follow, in that regard.

    4. It’s a non-partisan issue in that most of the elected officials have been corrupted by the Military Industrial Complex and it’s “Defense Contractors”. No mystery here.

    5. @Cannabizman Except liberal Democrat Barbara Lee. She voted against this corrupt stupid war right from the start. She was the smartest person in Congress.

  2. Twenty years and billions of dollars, but not that many lives when you compare it to the pandemic death toll. In pandemic terms, it was about two really bad days in a pandemic that has only gone on for a year and a half.

    1. And you never ask yourself that question how come none of the afghanis are wearing face masks if it’s a pandemic?

    1. @Joseph Mastroianni “Why do the nations rage, And the people plot a vain thing?
      The kings of the earth set themselves, And the rulers take counsel together,
      Against the LORD and against His Anointed” (Psalm 2:1).

    2. @John Sheffield
      I’m sorry. I dont feel a need to be judged for acceptance.
      Its not hard to be a good person.
      On Earth? Where people are visible.

    3. @Sunny Quackers
      FACTS. LIKE 1 MAN CALLED US AN ENEMY. NOT YOU USE free press pages & win elections.

    4. @Sunny Quackers
      Face the facts. YOU WONT ESCAPE THEM.
      BOSTON MASSACRE. 3/5/1770
      Some soldiers were innocent.
      I guess it wasnt a massacre.
      Just FakeNewZ.
      PAGE 1. BOOKS AND SCHOOLS.
      We dont get thanks.
      We just lose kings.

  3. People need to remember trump wanted to invite the Taliban to camp David on the anniversary of 911. Imagine?

    1. omgosh so let’s not talk about biden’s ineptness, heh? imagine criticizing Trump supporters for not supporting women then leaving half a country of 14 million in the hand’s of the taliban? But he let’s focus on an invitation. Brilliant.

    2. @Gnirol Namlerf Trump wanted to invite the Taliban to camp David on 911 . Jeeze my 12 yrd old grandchild would know better

    1. The U.S. invaded their Country, drone struck and murdered their women and children…and you don’t trust them???

      SMDH, American ignorance

    2. @Jay Larsen Bad planning at its worse but incompetence is to invite the Taliban to Camp David on 911. Even my grandchild would know better. Jeeze

    1. @Dorris Day just do a google search and the story is there about how Jill Biden’s husband claims it was the reason for their break uo

    2. @Dorris Day the whole thing is we need real leadership in this country and Joe Biden is not it… He is a failure and no matter what you think or thought of Trump… he did exactly what he promised. Biden’s credibility is zero. End of discussion.

  4. They sure put on a convincing act, didn’t they? This has to be the biggest grift in US history. How much money is in Afghani hands right now? How much war materiel? And I’ll bet that all that training is going to be put to good use now, too. Don’t ever forget the lives that it cost.
    I sincerely regret that this had to be such an incredibly expensive lesson on foreign entanglements.

    1. @Walter
      Trump just twisted the knife. Thank the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld ideologue cabal for getting AND keeping the ball rolling for their crony sponsors of the big project.

    2. @Dorris Day Exactly! Do not forget about all the private contractors under the Bush administration.

  5. It’s a sad ending, but if the highly trained Afghan army, chosed to give up without a fight, there’s nothing U.S can do about it!

    1. @Cloxade pretty sure all those people klinging to and running after the us planes don’t hate Americans.

    2. You understand they are saying they brokered a deal for the army to give up so Trump could make himself look good in 2024, right?

  6. The women should have been given the guns, they know they would have been fighting for their lives, and fought.

    1. @Jaak Savat You may consider it extreme, but they don’t. Even if it is extreme, that doesn’t negate the fact that it is their culture. Afghanistan is 73% rural and 27% urban. Sure in large cities like Kabul, many urbanites want a more modern lifestyle and may not subscribe to traditional Afghan culture, but in rural Afghanistan where the Taliban draws most of their support, their ideology is identical to the local culture. This may surprise you because foreign media has been covering only the minority who mostly live in cities.

    2. @jfoiwelakf qwhknskj the goal of the taliban eg mujahideen has always been consistent, ousting the infidels and install sharia law, in this case sunni, Saudi Arabia style and is the only tragic change, the rest will just be more corrupt and very little to do with culture

    3. @jfoiwelakf qwhknskj religion is not culture but music, dance, poetry, food, language, clothing, jewellery etc etc is culture.

    4. @jkelly bryant In the recent most election held in Afghanistan by the puppet US government, barely a million people voted and registered in a country of over 40 million. The so-called Afghan government only existed in Kabul. It was never present in the majority conservative Islamic society of Afghanistan’s mountains and valleys.

      Instead, those women and children were ducking for their lives as US bombs dropped on them. Most of Afghanistan is conservative and the Taliban have a billion times more legitimacy on rule than any so-called US puppet state. You have been deceived, the US was never doing anything good there. If they were, then the Afghan army would not have surrendered if there was something worth fighting for. It surely is not western secularism inside Islamic lands.

  7. The movie The Outpost comes to mind. Based on a true story, but of of course over dramatized for entertainment purposes. I thought them showing the Afghan soldiers fleeing after the Taliban attacked was part of that dramatization. Turns out it actually happened, and just like during that battle, the Afghan forces once again ran at the first sight of trouble.

  8. Afghans leaders: “We were never here to protect our people. We were here to profit and climb to positions of power thanks to the American money and protection.”

    1. @Alfred Basurto and why should they? I thought we all agreed that colonialism was over, was a bad idea….

    2. @Anne Rigby The Brits almost defeated Ho Chi Minh & were at the gates of Hanoi when the French requested that Vietnam be transferred back to France. The Brits advised the French on proper civilian governance & administration. The French ignored & subjugated all & sundry to their terror. Civilians became Commies & the French lost. Likewise, the Americans consulted with the Brits in the nascent stages of their Vietnam War. General Templar who had fought a successful campaign against Commies in Malaya, Singapore, Sarawak & Sabah, gave the same advice. The Yanks ignored it & royally botched it up. Americans put the blame squarely on Trump like as if he governed from the time of Washington till today. They forget that they preferred to elect President Biden, who is clearly suffering from dementia, instead of giving Clinton a clear & overwhelming mandate in 2016. The Yanks should have given her at least 60% of the votes guaranteeing her Presidency.

    1. ​@deef dragon Boarders / board·er
      /ˈbôrdər/
      noun

      plural noun: boarders
      1.
      a person who receives regular meals when staying somewhere, in return for payment or services.
      2.
      a person who boards a ship during or after an attack.

    2. american people got played war machine got theirs. no profit in winning. how much oil did you get after desert storm

      me none

  9. In a country where the median age is less than 19 years old, I’ll hang onto the flimsy hope that 20 years of quasi-democratic governance will eventually fuel an internal revolution.

    1. Yes, I tend to agree with you.
      We have supported and trained the Afghan people for over 20 years and when we finally left it up to them to work out what is going to happen in their country just as you would a son or daughter after 20 years they decided. We do not like it and many of them, I’m sure, do not like the decision that their own security forces have made, but they have been fighting for more than 40 years and it seems that they have made the decision to keep on fighting, as I suspect that many of the local warlords and many of the well trained security forces, will not, in the end be happy with Taliban rule.

    1. Trump was so proud when he yelled to his adoring fans that he cut US forces against the objection of the generals. I hope he keeps his mouth shut

  10. Us Army: Aren’t you gonna fight the Taliban?
    Afghanistan: no
    US Army: Why not?
    Afghanistan: my family is 75% Taliban, we’re just gonna change clothes the minute you leave

    1. @Sharon Mores The people there never asked for US intervention. They were not given a choice. Now they have to “change their clothes” or risk death. This whole thing was a huge costly 20-year mistake. US-style complete cultural “makeover” is and always a pipe dream. Things will change there when the AFGHAN people want it enough, not a moment sooner, no matter how powerful the foreign power is coming in there to “liberate” them from themselves…

    2. @Datch Guy Yes, exactly that. No outside invading powers (the British, the Russians /USSR, and until this week, the Americans) have yet had any long term success at breaking the traditional Afghan tribal, localised system of society, politics and culture, to which they’re now reverting once again.
      I’m sure the Taliban knew it was only a matter of time before the US model of government would collapse and they could resume business as usual.
      There still just isn’t the will, or the desire among enough of the Afghan population to change. As you suggest, it’s not as if they invited the Westerners into their country and asked to be ‘liberated’.

    3. @Datch Guy the long stay was founded on the premise of a UN resolution and an Afghan constitutional body asking for outside help… so that claim is not correct, whether you wanted that mission or not.

    4. @Pietro Merendino ironic all the draft dodgers from that war dragged us into this one 20 years ago.

    1. @Sunny Quackers And another 2-3 Trillion in American taxpayer money? The U.S. is NOT the world’s babysitter… if these people want freedom and democracy then they should be willing to fight for it…

  11. While I was over there, I always questioned “Why are we here?” Looks like we were just there to blow some money and lives away.

    1. Why did you go then? A large part of the blame lies in those who were complicit with the occupation, from those at the very top….all the way down to the lowest PFC and/or “Defense Contractor”.

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